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01:15 Sun 25 Sep 2005

Liam Fox talks utter crap.

Filed under: Health,News,Politics,Vociferate — 01:15 Sun 25 Sep 05

A short article in the Independent has this as the headline: Fox: Mental patients’ treatment a disgrace and Liam Fox (who just happens to want to lead the Bunch of Blue) claims that the mentally ill are getting poor treatment. What the fuck does this guy know ?

  • Who gave us the 1983 Mental Health Act ? The Conservatives
  • Who gave us the Community Care Act ? The Conservatives
  • Who closed the hospitals and replaced them with nothing ? The Conservatives
  • Who created a hospital system centred around profit which excludes the mentally ill virtually by default ? The Conservatives.

The pathetic Mr Fox ought to realise that taken overall the Labour party have done more for the care of the mentally ill and have done so from as far back as Enoch Powell and Barbara Castle. But go look at that article again – and check the last sentence: “sleeping in the doorways of some of our most beautiful buildings… then we are witnessing a policy failure that a humane society should not tolerate” It’s the aesthetics of the buildings that bothers him isn’t it ? He doesn’t give a flying one for the people, just the architecture.

Mental Health History Timeline

13 Comments »

  1. They are also saying that these people sleeping in the historic buildings have no respect for them therefore we should have no respect for those people.

    Bunch of wankers. Fox and his cronies I mean.

    Comment by Claire — 22:09 Sun 25 Sep 2005 @ 22:09 Sun 25 Sep 05

  2. Nice demonstration of prejudice on your part! Dr Fox genuinely believes that public policy has failed the most vulnerable members of our society. He had freely admitted that legislation on this issue by the last Conservative government is part of the problem.

    And you know what, SANE agress with him:

    September 16, 2005

    Tory campaign

    From the Chief Executive of SANE

    Sir, Ann Treneman seemed to suggest (Parliamentary Sketch, September 9) that Dr Liam Fox’s Conservative Party leadership campaign launch amounted to exploitation of those with mental illness.

    Throughout the last five years, Dr Fox has strongly supported the work of SANE and the callers who depend on its helpline, as well as other mental health organisations. As Shadow Health Secretary, he put the issue of mental illness at the heart of Conservative policy. On September 25, he will honour a long-standing commitment to visit the Prince of Wales International Centre for SANE Research.

    Those suffering from mental illness value enormously those senior politicians who have the courage to support such an unfashionable cause.

    MARJORIE WALLACE Aldgate, London

    Comment by James Hellyer — 14:44 Thu 29 Sep 2005 @ 14:44 Thu 29 Sep 05

  3. Mr Hellyer,
    Thank you for your comment, but I’m afraid I neither agree with many of Majorie Wallace’s views either.

    Comment by Mark — 15:17 Thu 29 Sep 2005 @ 15:17 Thu 29 Sep 05

  4. As a doctor perhaps he does know what he’s talking about

    Comment by tom — 15:28 Sat 1 Oct 2005 @ 15:28 Sat 1 Oct 05

  5. tom – Mengele was a Dr. Shipman was a Dr. A title does not bestow any weight more on what Liam Fox says than anyone else. In fact, to just believe what a ‘Dr’ says because he is a ‘Dr’ is beyond foolish.

    Comment by Mark — 17:00 Sat 1 Oct 2005 @ 17:00 Sat 1 Oct 05

  6. Dr Mengele? Goodwin much? :evil:

    Dr Fox is sincere in what he says; that you make such inappropriate paralells and put such negative spins on his words (“It’s the aesthetics of the buildings that bothers him isn’t it ?”) tells us very little about him, but informs us a lot about your knee jerk prejudices.

    Comment by James Hellyer — 17:15 Sat 1 Oct 2005 @ 17:15 Sat 1 Oct 05

  7. I’m currently reading about Simon Wiesenthal – hence Mengele’s name falling from the fingers so readily. Fact remains though that he was a Dr.

    And as for Dr Fox …. Now you are saying that I really should believe a Politician who has thrown his hat into the ring for the leadership of his Party ? C’mon …… Politicians lie. Routinely.

    How can you tell if a politician is lying ? His lips move.

    And while you are taking the time to praise Dr Fox from whatever distance you are from him, why do you seek to destroy my views ? Why do you not respect my right to have conflicting views ? Why do you not consider just how and why I feel the way I do ? Or is that because I am not a Dr ?

    Comment by Mark — 17:26 Sat 1 Oct 2005 @ 17:26 Sat 1 Oct 05

  8. Okay, you’re telling me more about your own prejudices :yawn:

    Politicians don’t routinely lie. Some do, but that doesn’t change the fact that most politicians are more public spirited than the rest of us. That’s why they go into politics. It’s simply disingeneous to claim that because some politicians are no good, that they are all bad.

    Now you are saying that I really should believe a Politician who has thrown his hat into the ring for the leadership of his Party ?

    Given that these are deeply unfashionable issues that Dr Fox is talking about, which are unlikely to be ones that win him much support from his peers, and his long established track record working alongside mental health charirities, I don’t think accepting his sincerity is too much to expect.

    Why do you not respect my right to have conflicting views ?

    I recognise your right to have views, but I also recognise that erroneous views are subject to challenge.

    Comment by James Hellyer — 17:37 Sat 1 Oct 2005 @ 17:37 Sat 1 Oct 05

  9. “but I also recognise that erroneous views are subject to challenge.”
    You say I am wrong.

    Mr Hellyer – how are you related to the Conservative party ?

    Comment by Mark — 17:44 Sat 1 Oct 2005 @ 17:44 Sat 1 Oct 05

  10. You say I am wrong.

    I believe you are, and have presented evidence from SANE that supports my view.

    Mr Hellyer – how are you related to the Conservative party ?

    Playing the man not the ball?

    Oh well, I’m just a member. No more.

    Comment by James Hellyer — 17:49 Sat 1 Oct 2005 @ 17:49 Sat 1 Oct 05

  11. Mr Hellyer – I shall try and state this clearly:

    1. I do not believe that Dr Fox genuinely feels what he says or has any intentions of carrying through any action in a way that will impact mental health care to any degree.
    2. SANE. While the organisation is a worthy one (I have linked to them for a few years now) I believe that it is politically expedient for Ms Wallace to say what she did, and it was also said from a professional standpoint – they can and do conflict with personal opinions.

    As for who is wrong – shall we let history judge ?

    Comment by Mark — 17:54 Sat 1 Oct 2005 @ 17:54 Sat 1 Oct 05

  12. 1. I do not believe that Dr Fox genuinely feels what he says or has any intentions of carrying through any action in a way that will impact mental health care to any degree.

    I think you’re wrong. He has been consistent on this issue since he was Shadow Health Secretary, and has been widely praised for his position by mental health charities. Also the issue is one not likely to benefit him in the party leadership election, which tends to rule out the ulteriior motive you attempted to ascribe.

    I believe that it is politically expedient for Ms Wallace to say what she did, and it was also said from a professional standpoint

    I don’t think you can write off her staunch defence of an opposition politician, who doesn’t even hold the health brief and who’s influence is limited, as an act of political expediency. That seems an especially cheap way of dismissing a viewpoint that contradicts your own:

    “Those suffering from mental illness value enormously those senior politicians who have the courage to support such an unfashionable cause.”

    Comment by James Hellyer — 18:13 Sat 1 Oct 2005 @ 18:13 Sat 1 Oct 05

  13. Doing something works. Supporting something is easy.

    Glad you’ve conceded that we will allow history to hold up the winners arm.

    Comment by Mark — 18:15 Sat 1 Oct 2005 @ 18:15 Sat 1 Oct 05

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